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[Brainstorming] 3dAC and Insurgency

 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 02 Aug 2014, 16:21 
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Well and then you have a super-organized BluFor and an even more bored-out insurgent team.

It is boring to death even now to wait for the enemies on the cache. How do you expect this to be when BluFor has to wait, organize, stay in main, etc etc? (Not saying it's a bad thing for them to do it, but you also have to think from INS perspective).

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 02 Aug 2014, 17:03 
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Nate wrote:
stay in main, etc etc? (Not saying it's a bad thing for them to do it, but you also have to think from INS perspective).


Allow attacks on main then.

Or seriously make it so that the Blufor needs to constantly have a presence in the battlefield with a offensive FOB, their only offensive FOB. If there is not FOB present they slowly lose tickets perhaps. If it is killed they need to get a new one up.

It would give Opfor something to focus their attacks on. An objective. At the same time Blufor cannot win by just holding the FOB. They need to send out troops to kill caches too.

Maybe that one FOB can help get them intel points depending on how close it is to the cache? Or how close it is to the middle of the map like CNC.

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 02 Aug 2014, 18:48 
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Age wrote:
Or seriously make it so that the Blufor needs to constantly have a presence in the battlefield with a offensive FOB, their only offensive FOB. If there is not FOB present they slowly lose tickets perhaps. If it is killed they need to get a new one up.

It would give Opfor something to focus their attacks on. An objective. At the same time Blufor cannot win by just holding the FOB. They need to send out troops to kill caches too.

Maybe that one FOB can help get them intel points depending on how close it is to the cache? Or how close it is to the middle of the map like CNC.


+1, this would surely address the bored part of insurgency. With the 1 cache only feature this would also split the team preventing cluster fucks around the cache.

Unfortunately with maps so small the mortars/rocket techie could always spam the Blu for cache.

I'm more inclined for AAS-INS  than CNC-INS, like they did in Burning sands.

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 02 Aug 2014, 19:00 
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Remove mortars for both teams then. They are a neat concept, but you make do without them 70% of the time. Can't remember having to deal with mortars the last two weeks I've been playing.

And yeah, I stated that with 1 cache in mind.

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 02 Aug 2014, 21:25 
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It probably was suggested before, but either put a flag that needs to be capped by BluFor to get intel points. The flag could be a strategic objective (bridge, outpost...) Or as it was said a few posts back, make the main act like a "fortified FOB" that can be attacked by INS.

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 02 Aug 2014, 22:02 
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WARNING SHITHUGE POST!


hotfranc wrote:
It probably was suggested before, but either put a flag that needs to be capped by BluFor to get intel points. The flag could be a strategic objective (bridge, outpost...)  Or as it was said a few posts back, make the main act like a "fortified FOB" that can be attacked by INS.


I actually want a main to be separate from the FOB.

Without the FOB Blufor loses tickets. This means they need to get one up quickly in order to stop that bleed. I am not sure if it is possible but it would be cool if the bleed started after a specific time. Give Blufor 5 minutes to set up a FOB in a good place, if they don't have one after that then they get a bleed.

Opfor will have incentive to attack the FOB and destroy it, giving them the upper hand by causing a bleed. This generates a goal for them rather than defending caches all the time.

When blufor knows where the cache is they need to divert enough troops to attack it but keep enough to defend their FOB. Same for Opfor.

Opfor wouldn't get any intel on the FOB though? Maybe they should? I guess the intel-point system can be applied in reverse, but in all likelyhood Opfor would likely know where to look for this FOB and since it would be put closer to the middle (more on that later) it would be in the middle of the action.

Problems I can see are:
Placement of FOB
Blufor buildign FOB next to main or somewhere in the open on Basrah or some shit. A place hard to get to for Opfor.

Possible solution:
a. Restriction of how close to main it can be built.
b. Make it so that the further into the map the FOB is placed the more intel points you get. This is logical since having a presence in enemy territory is going to give you hints on enemy activity. Placing an FOB in a fuckoff place in the corner of the map is not beneficial. You would get almost no intel points (I think it should be heavy on the intel loss here). Placing it in the middle of the city will get you a more normal average etc. Perhaps it can be done so it varies depending on how close it is to the cache instead?

The way I see it intel points should be removed from killing regular Opfor. They would swarm to attack it and likely lose a lot of men doing so. Giving Blufor intel points for proximity of FOB + that will be too much. This furthers the incentive to actually build and maintain a FOB somewhat close to the middle of the city/action. You ain't getting no intel points without it. Capturing civvies would give them still though?


Destruction of FOB
Mortars fucking everything over in a radius of 500miles.
Bomb-cars/SPG/rocket techie (that one exists, I wanna try it)

Possible solution:
Mortars should be removed for both sides. They would make it too easy to blow the FOB up for Opfor and giving them to Blufor when they already have a bunch of assets is just dickish.  

Bomb cars and SPGs are easier to counter. A bomb-car has to get into the proximity of the FOB, same with FOB. They would be legit. Same with rocket techie I guess. But I don't know how that one functions. The thing is they are all not able to put in a constant bombardment of hell from above in the way mortars are. I presume they all need to get in some sort of visual range and/or need to rearm at times. This gives the Blufor the ability to rebuild the FOB if it gets damaged. Really though, they should have an outer perimeter defence for this thing too.



Other changes I'd like to see/discuss

Tunnels
More tunnels. Look at Dragon Fly. It has a nice tunnel beneath the ground. I know it is not likely to happen, but if more devs did that for future maps it would truly be amazing.

Civvies
Civvies broken. Make it a proper kit and not so that everyone can drop theirs and go all retard. If it is a proper kit it can obviously be made so that you are punished harsher. Don't punish the entire team, but what about if every civvie you kill lose you intel points and 2 tickets? Like you are essentially killing one of your own?
Opan added some thoughts after talking to him. Civvies should be restricted to a kit first and foremost. No dropping your kit and magically civvie. It should also be a restricted kit to maybe 2/squad. Wasting civvies and running into enemy fire is now something that cannot be done spontaneously or in large numbers as a squad. One squad can no longer act as a meat shield either.

Mobility for Opfor
Cars should be protected as someone mentioned earlier. You don't go in and shoot up the populations transportation if you want them on your side. Destroying empty cars should be the same as civvies. Blufor looses intel points and maybe tickets. If it is populated then who gives a fuck. Blow it up.

More hideouts would be awesome too. Would get the effect that Opfor can come from any house anywhere.

They should also move quicker and run longer. No heavy shit to carry and all. Could give more emphasis to the hit-n-run tactics. Hit a squad and run the fuck away. They can't catch you since you are now Usain Bolt.


Caches
One at the time + Blufor FOB.




Conclusion

In my opinion this would make INS a bit more like AAS. Both Opfor and Blufor would have a defensive and offensive objective. They need to allocate resources to keep their stuff alive while destroying the enemy. We already work it like this at times. When I play Opfor a common tactic is finding the Blufor and killing them before they can mount an attack. This would essentially be that with a clear-cut objective.

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 04 Aug 2014, 21:05 
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Well this thing died.

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 05 Aug 2014, 09:20 
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I welcome any changes making INS more alike to AAS, but shouldn't you guys bring this up to the PR-DEVs?

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 05 Aug 2014, 09:53 
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  • Removing-Mortars
  • 1-Cache
  • Re-design cache locations
  • Made insurgents quicker
  • Bring back the Arty IED (Buff the current one)
  • Prevent the destruction of transportations
  • Killing Civilians =Insta-kill
  • Killing Civilians = spawn delay
  • Killing Civilians = Ina curate Cache marker
  • Removing Fobs for Blufor
  • Smaller distance between fobs
  • Creation of an Objective to Opfor

If I didn't missed the these are the current ideas.

Creating an objective to Opfor, removing mortars and the smaller distance between fobs seems the best to way to improve gameplay. 

But I still thing there's a issue with the balance. Even by making the cache's marker inaccurate w/ the death of civilians, this won't prevent APC's from raping everything.

I still believe we need to give more power to civilians or at least create a "Hostage kit", this kit would be pick-up only and would make a black-screen, for 2m, if we would drop it or pick-up another kit.

This needs to exist to control Blufor's rate of fire.

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 Post subject: Re: 3dAC and Insurgency
PostPosted: 05 Aug 2014, 11:54 
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Sibren wrote:
I welcome any changes making INS more alike to AAS, but shouldn't you guys bring this up to the PR-DEVs?
UTurista wrote:
My idea, if you guys are up for it, is to make a "letter" to the dev team with the changes we think this game mode needs, but first we need to actually think in these changes.


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